Surround Yourself With Angels
Mark Murphy lost his twenty-one-year-old daughter Lizzie to fentanyl poisoning. He has worked tirelessly to try to make sure other families don’t experience a similar loss. An Ohio native, Mark has traveled the country to share his experiences and learn from those who are trying to stop the flow of fentanyl into the US. Mark shares his observations about the dangers of fentanyl and what is being done, and not done, to stem the flood of drugs into and across the country. A media report of one of those trips to Cochise County, Arizona, can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Tei0aOSqdI. More than 100,000 individuals lost their lives last year to a synthetic opioid overdose in the United States. If you want to know what you can do locally, get involved, support prevention activities, call or email legislators, ask your local school what they are doing to educate the students, and, most of all, talk to your children.
[Jaunty Guitar Music]
Mike: Welcome everyone. This is Avoiding the Addiction Affliction, a series brought to you by Westwords Consulting. I'm your host, Mike McGowen.
Mike: We're gonna have another of those conversations about the ongoing opioid epidemic. Seems like we've had a lot of them. They're never ending. Mark Murphy is the president of an international company, and that's not why he is here today.
Mike: He's also the father who lost his daughter Lizzie, to Fentanyl poisoning. Mark has been kind enough to join us today to talk about Lizzie, the work he and others have done to raise fentanyl poisoning awareness.
Mike: Welcome, Mark.
Mark: Hey, thanks for having me Mike. Really appreciate the opportunity.
Mike: Well, yeah, unfortunately we've done a lot of these with a lot of families. And I'm sure you know many of them, especially in your area, but I always like to start out by talking about a little bit about your daughter. Talk about Lizzie a little bit.
Mark: Well, the first thing I always have to say is, my heart goes out to any parent that's lost a child for any reason. I always say that first cause I don't ever want to forget that because the grief is brutal. So no matter what your son or daughter died from, no matter the age, it is just a tough road.
Mark: So that's, oh, I always like to get that out first. Because I so much love for us parents that have to deal with after your child dies. Just, just the torture of, of grief. My daughter was just like you know, just a young girl, 21 years of age. Graduated high school. She was not your typical, every, every situation is unique for every child or young person that passes away due to poisoning.
Mark: But she was not what you'd think of as an addict. Just living her life. And she smoked her fair share of weed and all that stuff. And did battle with some, you know anxiety and the mental type of issues, you know, trying to deal with life in general like a lot of young people have.
Mark: And one terrible day June 5th this month, which is a terrible day for us, as leading up to the June 5th is just a tough day. She took a, what she thought was a Xanax and one pill, one time you're done. And that turned into just you know, a living worst parent nightmare. And the reason why we knew that, that it was one, it was the pill is because the DE agent came to my house, really great guy, and we sat and talked and he showed me the bag and the pills.
Mark: And I was like, oh my God. I mean, he showed me what, you know, what my daughter took and it just broke my heart. So, and to think that your child can be snuffed out for a pill that we'll talk about later, if you want, that the cost is about a dollar at the border, so maybe $15 for the pill. And a lot of these young people, it's very difficult to get with a psychiatrist, a psychologist these days because it's a two month wait.
Mark: You gotta pay out of pocket. It's $250. You know, people can't afford it. You can't get in when you need to get in. And these kids are trying to level themselves out and there's no safe dosage of fentanyl. It's just all bad and it's all mixed with any kind of pill that is not prescribed your, for your doctor, from your doctor, excuse me.
Mark: Assume that if you take something that a friend supposedly gave you you know, assume you're gonna die. And that's what happened to my daughter.
Mike: Well, okay. If she suffered from anxiety, then my guess is that Xanax is used for anxiety. That probably wasn't the first time she had used Xanax. And this time it wasn't Xanax.
Mark: Correct correct. Our guess it's not because you don't really know a lot of it because once your daughter turns 18 or your son or daughter, whatever it is, HIPAA laws. Doctors won't tell you anything. Yeah. So you kinda at a loss as to what they're prescribing, what they're taking. You don't know the whole story, you never do with any of this.
Mark: But for sure she took Xanax. I mean, I would just bet she did, and whatever else, Percocet, whatever else, you know, they could get their hands on. I'm sure they took.
Mike: I think, I think you made a really good point and nobody has made that on these podcasts before, which is that wait to see a therapist and the difficulty of navigating the system.
Mike: And we've had podcasts on the difficulty of navigating the system. Lead some people to bind some of what they think are these prescription drugs on the street.
Mark: That's what they do. And it's, it's getting worse. It's continuing, it's not getting better. And I'm not really one with statistics because the statistic hit us right in the face.
Mark: But from what I've, what I've been told by the DEA is that about 6 out of 10 of the pills are bad. So my mind is why not just say 10 out of 10?
Mark: Because doctors aren't prescribing like they used to because of all the lawsuits with opioids. So they are not prescribing what they used to because they're in fear as well.
Mark: So there's this huge you know, vacuum and we, you know, we are the perfect society for it, man. Everything is suicidal thoughts, everything is depression, everything's anxiety all the social media stuff. So we are the perfect customer for all this stuff. That's what I'm seeing.
Mike: And, Lizzie left behind a sister as well.
Mark: Yeah, yeah. 18 months apart. I mean, it's devastating. It's tough as, as a father knowing that you cannot help them. I can't help my wife. I can't help my daughter. I don't mean help, meaning be supportive, but I mean, I can't take that pain away. That's probably the hardest thing about when you have a tragedy in your life, you cannot take the pain away from another family member.
Mike: Well, and I think that's, that's part of what I've was reading. That's what you're trying to do, is to try to ease other families pain by making a difference. So you've, you've done quite a bit to learn, educate, prevent, and. Recently you went down to Cochise County in Arizona. I, I'm from Arizona and that's where I grew up.
Mike: Tell us about the trip.
Mark: Well, it was interesting because my sheriff in Butler County, who was at my daughter's funeral.
Mike: Now this is Ohio, Butler County Ohio.
Mark: Butler County Ohio, just near Cincinnati.
Mark: So it's the middle of the country, right. You shouldn't have this here border shouldn't be right here.
Mark: But the sheriff called me. And I really admire him, Sheriff Jones, because it takes guts to call a parent that lost a child. And he called me like 9:30 at night. He's like, Mark, I'm gonna ask you something. I'm like, whatever. Because after my daughter died, I, I say yes to everything. Like your podcast. Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Mark: And he goes, I was invited to the border and I would like you to come if you want. It might help you out. And I've invited a news team and what was nice about the news team as you saw some of the video, is we went for health reasons. When it comes to grief, there is no politics.
Mark: There really isn't. However, when how's at the border, everything's political and that's the hard part about all this is it upsets me that. All of us Americans can't get behind this issue all as one. I don't see how an issue like this should be political in any way. It should be right or wrong, whether you're left or right and just do the right thing for America.
Mark: So being at the border and we just, I was, I'm the only American that I know, Mike, that lost a child to fentanyl, I call it murder, poisoning. That was embedded with the Cochise Sheriff's Department for two days. I was in their squad cars. We were going through the mountainous areas. We had debrief meetings.
Mark: We went, we met with prosecutors. I saw firsthand how bad it really is at the border. And the image that I had about the border was just a bunch of families crossing over, holding hands, and looking for a better life. But the areas that we were looking at were the areas where the smugglers are coming in.
Mark: And, and the smugglers. These are hardcore men. Probably teams of 18 to 20. They're in great shape. They're wearing these little backpacks and they're cruising through. They're bringing people and drugs, and they're not bringing marijuana because marijuana, it's available in the United States, and there's no real return on your investment.
Mark: If you're carrying a backpack of weed, what are you gonna make? $200? If you have fentanyl and everything I talk about I can back it up with facts. So I'm just talking factual. The president, Jaime Puerta, he's a president of Void and that's another group of, of Fentanyl was trying to stop drug abuse and all that.
Mark: He told me that a $15,000 investment in fentanyl with like one of these pill pressing machines. Turns into a street value of over $1 million. And I verified that two times. Now, I went to a public high school and a public college, so I'm not that good at math. But if you invest $15,000 and you're at $1.2 million return on your investment, I'm not sure what profit that is.
Mark: That's immense. So that's the drive to do it. And then you have the people here that are willing to take it and it's a terrible, and, and what I saw. I actually, you know, I, I actually broke down a little bit because what I saw, what was coming through a dollar a pill and they're racing this through the border.
Mark: And, and Americans are picking this up and shipping it to Cincinnati, to every single town cuz they, you know, they wanna make the money and I didn't see any of it stopping. And that's what was heartbreaking. I lost my daughter and I just keep, and, and I see it in our fentanyl groups every day we're adding 200 and something, people that have lost their kids and I'm like, oh my God, why can't we get, you know what, you know?
Mark: Why can't we have like a national campaign to just stop it? I just don't see the will. I don't see it, Mike.
Mike: Well, and even if you at at, at that kind of a return, even if you stop a group, stop two groups, stop 10 groups. You don't need many groups to come through to get through, to be able to turn a huge profit. Right.
Mark: That's pretty tough to pass up.
Mike: Yeah, what, so, you know, you're talking about what you saw and I understand it, you know, once it's over here, they're actually recruiting our citizens in high schools and colleges to then carry it throughout the country.
Mark: I didn't expect that. So we're at the border and they have a menu and, and this menu is not let's just say it's not politically correct.
Mark: The menu is, first the people, every person from a different country has a different value. For example, Asians coming across the border was between 10 to $25,000. They bring them over along with the drugs. So what happens is, The cartels bring all these people to the border, this blew me away. And they're so sophisticated with their social media apps.
Mark: They advertise in all these kids' sites and young people's sites to where these young people come in and they make a buck by picking up people and the drugs. And it's pinpointing using these apps. So specific like a, like Google Maps or Waze, whatever system they're using. They press a little button and it tells 'em where they're waiting.
Mark: So these kids come by, young people that honk the horn a couple times, and the people jump in. And when they advertise this, these young people might not know that they're actually picking up hardcore people with hardcore drugs. That's what we, you know, that's the chase that you saw that we were on. So they pick him up.
Mark: One kid borrowed his mom's car outta their garage. Drove from Phoenix, I think it was like a two and a half hour drive in his mom's Cadillac. And he was in the game. He was in the game. So he picks em up and you got the drugs, the fentanyl, you have the people and then they tell you to hit the gas. So you're driving a hundred miles an hour, literally a hundred miles an hour.
Mark: Cause they want to beat where the police are because they know where all the police are as well, or the sheriff's department. That's what they do. It's such an effective, in terms of, as a business owner myself, the logistics are something Amazon would be impressed with. I mean, just the, you know, the way they communicate with the emojis, it's, I mean, they're not dumb people.
Mark: The cartels, they are not dumb. They're a lot smarter than we are, or at least that some people give credit for. So, to me, that, that is what kind of woke me up. I was blown away by just the, just how impressive the organization is.
Mike: Since you spent so much time with the law enforcement there.
Mike: Do they feel like they're making a difference?
Mark: They try to, but they know they can't stop it all, so they just do what they can do. It's tough to hire people so they're having problem with, you know, getting people to come in. Most of the people I worked with were retired military, so a lot of these people had training cuz where they're working in, in the areas.
Mark: I mean, some of the areas looked like if you saw some in pictures, looks like Afghanistan. They've never been to Afghanistan, but the pictures that I've seen kind of mountainous terrain, very dry they're just overwhelmed and they are not getting the support from the government. They're just not.
Mike: You know, I, I Mark sent me a 15 minute phone video that he took from inside of a law enforcement car as they did a, a high speed chase.
Mike: And they're smuggling, you know, people, right? People as well as drugs. And one of the things that struck me in the video Mark was you know, you are, you're reacting with the other passengers in the video to what you're going through, and that your heart had to be beaten a mile a minute. Right?
Mark: I, well, I, I sent you the video because it wasn't a, I, I, obviously, I didn't know what was gonna happen.
Mark: And I asked for permission first if I could film, and he is like, "Sure, go ahead man." And driving a hundred miles an hour and a, and a, I've never driven that I can recall.
Mark: A hundred mile an hour chase.
Mark: And these people that were running from the police, they put down the spikes twice and they just kept going tires were blowing out. You saw the video. It's pretty, it's pretty horrific at the end, you know, they had to bring the life flight and I, I think they all made it, but the car, they, the car flipped over and cause they don't know what they're gonna run into.
Mark: We had one meeting with the prosecutor's office that said one of the people that they were looking for, they captured he was wanted in Chicago for decapitating somebody. So these are some hardcore people, so they're not like families that you have this vision of people crossing the border for a better life.
Mark: These are criminals, they're hardcore. So these, these wonderful American you know, sheriff deputies, great Americans, they don't know what they're gonna walk into. So they have to be prepared like, like, you know, go time at all times because the craziness is just it, it's insanity at the border.
Mike: I was struck by how you're all reacting in the car and the officer sounded calm as though he's ordering breakfast.
Mark: Yes. Yeah, he's they do this every day.
Mike: Right? That's the point, right?
Mark: Yeah, but I mean, it, it, it's, it's that intense every day for them. Now, maybe not as crazy as the video you had that I sent you, but in terms of what they're dealing with, because these smugglers, like I said, they're hardcore people bringing hardcore drugs over and you know, they have to be prepared and these guys are all seriously trained just great people and it's it was shocking.
Mike: You know, you you referenced getting things done earlier and that I, I wanted to spend some time on that. I've done a lot of these, and it does seem in all of them that you all, and by you all I mean, families who have experienced a tragedy, are able to get more done in a shorter period of time than the people we elect to do it regardless of party.
Mike: What have you discovered as you try to get things done?
Mark: The first thing I've discovered is there isn't a meaner animal mammal than a mother that's lost a child.
Mark: A mother. The second meanest is the father. So it just seems like women, I just, the way it seems like what a lot of organizations, but they're really spearheading a lot of this.
Mark: And once you have lost a child, your perspective changes on everything and. I am, well, for example, we have a march, September 23rd call with a group called Lost Voices of Fentanyl. So we're gonna march on DC. The third annual March. So that helps bring awareness to everything. But what I'm trying to encourage people, and I've had many conversations, is to run for office.
Mark: Because you have to have people, like I told you before, there is no politics and grief, but all this is political. It's all political. Whatever side [inaudible], it's all political cuz you have to change laws. You have to make things happen. So I'm trying to encourage people in our groups to run for political office.
Mark: That's how you make change. You have to get inside the capitol in terms of running for something or helping in a, in a proposed laws. My congressperson happens to be, his name is Warren Davidson from the eighth District of Ohio. He's a great guy. He actually showed up at my daughter's funeral and I didn't invite anybody and he's, and he's trying to get a bill passed.
Mark: Part of the pass called "Stop the Cartels". So I mean, so it, you have to get active and you have to know how to be active and talk to politicians as well. So whoever your representatives are, you have to get politically active as well, because you have to make yourself important to a lot of these politicians.
Mark: The only way you can do it is politically. So you have to call their office respectfully and ask for their help and help them become aware of it. And then when you do, when you educate. That's when politicians feel like they can talk about it when they know about it. And my congressman, I, and he's done this two or three times, he's done it on the house floor and I told you the same thing, please talk about my daughter.
Mark: That's okay. You can use her name. And I even told you this. Ask me any questions you want because it's important to educate. And once we do, the Congresspeople will feel comfortable about talking about the issue. Then hopefully then change will come and that's what we're looking to do.
Mike: Yeah, I believe he actually did that.
Mike: I, I saw your daughter's name in the congressional record.
Mark: Mm, yeah. Yeah, he did. And that's he's, I just share one little story about him. This is crazy. I mean, it's just really awesome. As every parent that's, that's lost a child knows holidays are terrible. So I, so when we lost my daughter on Christmas Eve, the year my daughter died, I get a phone call and it says Warren Davidson.
Mark: I'm like, what? I'm with my wife cuz we're just numb cuz Christmas isn't Christmas. The holiday's not a holiday anymore. Those are, I don't even celebrate those anymore. And he called me. I mean, my congressman called me to say, I know this must be so tough for you, but my wife and I, never advertises, never told anybody.
Mark: But that's the kind of politicians that we all need, that people care about, the people that are being affected by loss. So when we all have politicians like that, that truly do care that's when I think we'll see change.
Mike: Well, wow. I I have to ask you, you know, how are you doing? How's your wife doing?
Mark: It, it, it's difficult. It still is difficult. I try to, when you first get hit with this, what's important is what I tell parents is you gotta stay pure. Drink tons of water. You have to be strong. I didn't miss a workout. I worked out the very next morning with my friend when I barely had enough strength to open up the closet door.
Mark: I was that weak. You need to stay away from pharmaceuticals. You need to stay away from alcohol. So you have to, you have to go through a tragedy pure. So we all recognize that my daughter and my wife. So I sat down with them after my daughter died and I said, look, I can't fix this. We've gotta get through this together.
Mark: So we're all kind of made a, you know, a pact to just make sure that we're pure as we go through it. And I think what's difficult is after you've lost your soul, part of your soul. Cause that's what my daughter was to me. I just loved her. I mean, just, it was, she was the best part of my life.
Mark: Once you, once you are hit with a tragedy, you're slammed into a tragedy. You can't get slammed back out of it, Mike. So you gotta work at it, and you gotta work every day. And I didn't expect to be so tired. It mentally, I mean, physically, I can kind of hang with it and just kind of burn through it. But what all of us parents understand is that, I mean, you just get so tired during the day because it, it just wears on you, man.
Mark: It wears on you. So I think part of what, going back to your question is we're doing good, but you have to kind of try to find out what your purpose is now. Like my goals have all changed. I wanted to run for, you know, political office. I wanna do good positive things. But when you've been hit by this, you're so beaten down that you just gotta keep striving for your sense of purpose and really find the good things in life and just lean into positive things and not negative things, and that's how you come out of a tragedy slowly, but Methodical. So that's what we're working on.
Mike: Well, you lead me into always, the next thing I want to ask you is then what are you all doing to take care of yourself? Like how do you stay centered and not, not go down the whirlpool?
Mark: Like I was saying, you, you have to stay off pharmaceuticals. Like, I will not take a sleeping pill.
Mark: My wife will not take a sleeping pill. I mean a prescribed sleeping pill, like I'll take an Advil PM or Ibuprofen, but you gotta watch your alcohol intake because that can really, I mean, that can really slam you. So it's a matter, I call it, surrounding myself with angels. So I, I try to surround myself with angels all the time in my world.
Mark: So any negativity. I cast out, you know, out of my world. So I just look for things in places that are positive and that is how we're getting through it. And, and, and then also recognizing as a family that sometimes we need space. If I'm, you know, if, if my wife she'll just be crying out of the blue in the shower or something, I'm like, oh my God, there's nothing I can do, or I'll.
Mark: Sometimes, you know, when I, I drive a lot for business and I'll have to pull over. I'll start driving like one hour I'm exhausted. That's never the case for me. I used to drive for 8, 10 hours nonstop. But it, but it wears you out. So you have to recognize when it's hitting you that it's okay to be tired, man.
Mark: It's okay to be good to yourself and be kind and recognize when you're going through a bad period that it's okay. It's okay that I have to take a nap every once in a while because I'm so beat from what grief does to you. Because when your life is slammed in tragedy and it's out of order, it's not your dog dying. It's not your mom or dad, it's not your brother and sister. It is your child. Everything changes. So you have to have a strong constitution. You have to be, and I always say, I have water here too. I hydrate all the time. You gotta keep working out. You have to go for walks, you gotta keep strong and.
Mark: You should be strong in life anyway because life is, I mean, tragedy is gonna hit all of us at one time or another. We're gonna hit, we all will be hit with grief. It's part of the human condition. It's part of being a human. So you just have to be able to, just get through it. And what I like to say, Mike, is I don't say gotta keep moving forward.
Mark: The term I use is you gotta keep moving.
Mark: Just keep moving, get up, get out of bed, walk to the mailbox. I used to walk to the mailbox like 10 times a day and I knew there was no mail there. Why am I doing this? And I would even open up the mailbox knowing there was no mail in there.
Mark: So [laugh] some of those are the things you just gotta, you gotta keep moving. So that's, and keep positive. And that's, and that's kind of what I implore people to do.
Mike: I think if I was your neighbor and I saw you doing that, I'd stick stuff in your mailbox.
Mark: Oh, trust me. They, you know, they're like, Hey, Mark, mail hasn't come yet.
Mark: I go, "I know, I know".
Mike: You know, it's funny you said the thing about taking a nap. I talked to a couple of friends of yours a couple weeks ago Tom and Stephanie, and after our podcast, they said, "Ah, we gotta go take a nap now". And I thought that learning how to take care of yourself when you're not feeling great is not the easiest thing in the world to do.
Mark: Well, I, I told him that we, we joked about that because I'm very, that's why I'm telling, you know, I'm very open about grief cuz a lot of times men and most of the grief groups, it's, I would say it's 90% women.
Mark: Men, it's either they're, they're just wimpier I think, I mean, I just have to say it. They just, they, they hold it in more and I try to be very expressive.
Mark: Just so I can open up about it and what I told you. Talked to Tom and Stephanie. They live in our area. Their son died of fentanyl and poisoning as well. It's terrible. And I, we were joking about it. I go, Tom, man, I, I go, because I had asked another guy, I goes, it just me or are you like, flat out, exhausted?
Mark: He goes, "Oh my God, Mark. I, I get tired too". I go "Sometimes. I mean, I'll get up, I'll go work out and I have to take a half hour nap. It's like I just woke up". So, yeah, so you just gotta take care of yourself and part of it's being pure. You really gotta watch yourself. There's a lot of people I've talked to that have, it's easy to go the other side.
Mark: It's easy to go to the dark side and you know, you just start getting involved in drugs. You start going with a bar, start drinking. Then you know, I, the way I see it, Mike, is when I'm gone, I want my daughter to know that I was the kind of guy that stood up for her. And hammered through something that was difficult.
Mark: And I want to be the example for her that when life comes at you with the worst tragedy, that I want to be that example for her and my wife. I want my family to flourish from this, not to be buried in the ground. So that's my ongoing goal and that's, that's my motivation.
Mike: Well, and you know, these stories Mark aren't unique.
Mike: You know, you, you mentioned your friends who live in your. Near you. Well, I think I read that your county lost last year, what, 800 people to this?
Mark: It's a lot. I mean, it, it, it's a lot everywhere. And what's amazing to me, Mike, is that it's the number one cause of death. And I keep saying that to my friends and, and it, it says 18 to 45, but that's just the average.
Mark: But if you look at the, you know, the other portion of it, that doesn't mean that, you know, a 16 year old's not dying. A 15, a 12, a 2 year old and older than that. So it varies. And it's the number one, it's not COVID. It's not climate change, it's not everything else they're pushing. It's not heart disease, it's not gun violence, it's not knife violence, it's fentanyl poisoning.
Mark: Related to overdoses as well. Whether they mix it with whatever they mix it with, number one. And it's just seems like there's no real recognition about it. And that's what, that's to me, is the most disturbing thing. And there's people that I even know that. They're like, oh, wow. It's number one people that I know.
Mark: And they're like yeah. It's number one. Number one. Yeah. Not two, three number.
Mike: You know, I know it clearly, you know it, and our listeners know it, but I am amazed that so few people do. I do trainings for staff and social workers across the country, and many times I have to explain it to them and they're working in it.
Mike: This, that's why we keep doing these podcasts. It's an epidemic. Well, I, I'll let you have a way outta here. What, what, additionally, from what all you've said, what can people do to help?
Mark: What I tell my friends, like on my Facebook friends and stuff, I just think just the awareness of when you see like a news article that says, "Fentanyl accidental overdose."
Mark: Well, it's like Ray Lewis's son just died.
Mike: Yes, I saw that.
Mark: And apparently I didn't see everything, so I don't know. I don't want to, I hate to even, cause it's horrible no matter what your son dies. But for people to acknowledge that it's a poisoning, that it's murder, it's not an accident. So when, so all my friends now, my Facebook, we're all pretty much, they're all on board with, and they're sharing me articles about.
Mark: About the poisoning and about how the news is kind of changing a little bit. So I think that's important too. But one thing I, I will, I, I'd like to, I'll kind of kinda leave you on, and what I tell people when I, because I was thinking about, I was speaking to a group of young people and I'm like, man, what would resonate with them to not take something right?
Mark: So here's, and here, here's what I say, Mike, and this is what I would share with people, friends of yours that are talking to their kids and kind thing is this.
Mark: If you have somebody in life that, that you love, I'm, I'm not gonna tell you to stop doing drugs cuz you're not gonna listen to me. You're not. But if you have somebody you love in your life, brother, your sister, your mom, dad, grandma, grandpa, somebody you love, and you're out and somebody offers you something, a pill, think twice before taking it because you're dead.
Mark: You're gone. Consider yourself dead. You're done. But that pain you leave. For the rest of your family members and friends never ends. So before you put a pill in your mouth, think twice about it knowing that you're gonna die. And that's just my, that's what I like to resonate with people so they can share what I think that resonates with, with people that are considering taking a pill that somebody gave them, you might as well take a gun and play Russian roulette cuz you have a better chance playing that game than you do.
Mark: With a pill being an actual Xanax or whatever you think it is.
Mike: Mark I really appreciate you sharing all of this. I know it's really difficult, but it's always very helpful.
Mike: You know, you've heard these stories before. I think Mark's advice is great.
Mike: We encourage you to listen in next time when we talk about more of these issues. Mark mixed everything from addiction, drug awareness to mental health and to this little talk. Appreciate it greatly.
Mike: We invite you to join us next time. And until next time, stay safe. And in the words of Mark, surround yourself with angels.
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