The Need Still Exists

[Upbeat Guitar Music]

Mike: Welcome everybody. This is Avoiding The Addiction Affliction, brought to you by Westwords Consulting. I'm Mike McGowan.

Mike: This is Mental Health Awareness Month. To say it's an issue right now is a huge understatement. We're gonna talk about the challenges and obstacles to getting help with our guest, Martina Gollin-Graves.

Mike: Martina is the CEO of Mental Health America of Wisconsin. She has a master's degree in social work. And expertise in clinical and macro systems social work. Welcome Martina.

Martina: Oh, thank you Mike. It's nice to be here.

Mike: Well, I'm so glad you could join us, especially this month. I read, I read I think on the Alverno website that you were initially a clinician, but you enjoyed direct service, but thought you could help more in a bigger way.

Martina: (laughs) Oh, that's hilarious. Yeah, I remember that article. It's true. As an undergrad at Alverno I really thought that I wanted to be a therapist long term. And when I went to grad school and was exposed to many of the systems that impact the people that I wanted to serve, that seemed to be, more aligned with my own values and my interests. So here I am macro social work.

Mike: Now well, I read it in the introduction as expertise in clinical and macro systems social work, because I didn't wanna get wrong. Did, is that actually a degree?

Martina: So in the social work field at least in my day, I'm not quite sure how they offer it now.

Martina: Yep. So I did a track. To where I studied clinical social work, and so I did two internships doing clinical practice, one at Aurora Psych and one at the counseling center. And then I did another track where I was deeply involved in macro systems in the community. So, you know, it's true. (laughs)

Mike: Yeah, it's funny. It's very similar to my belief system. I thought I could help more on when I was doing the prevention end of it, and that's why I chose this. Well, what is your work with Mental Health America Wisconsin entail? It's been around a long time.

Martina: It has been around a long time. So literally we are celebrating our 95th year of serving folks in the community.

Martina: We at one time were the Mental Health Association. And then we became the Mental Health Association of Milwaukee County. And our affiliate brand changed to Mental Health America. And then we became the parent organization, Mental Health America of Wisconsin, oh gosh, about 20 years ago, which is as long as I've been with the organization.

Mike: Wow. That's a long time.

Martina: It is.

Mike: Yeah. And what is the Uplift Wisconsin Statewide Warmline?

Martina: Yeah, so the work that we started out doing as an agency way before my time was really focused on advocacy, supporting individuals and families who have mental health and substance use issues.

Martina: But over the years we have really not changed our mission to advocate, educate, and serve, but really thinking about how to best serve our communities. And so during COVID. When people were isolated more and more and it was harder for people to make connections, we received some dollars to start the Uplift Warmline, which is a non-crisis telephone service that is at no cost to individuals across Wisconsin.

Mike: Did anybody use it?

Martina: Oh yeah. (laughs) So our first year, interestingly when we finally got things up and running, you know how that is with the new program?

Mike: Yep.

Martina: It was about a half a year. We had about 10,000 calls in less than six months. Our second year, so that was the end of 2023. The second year, which was 2024, we operated for the entirety of the year, 12 months. We had more than 24,000 calls. And then just in the first quarter of 2025, we had 7,500 calls.

Mike: Wow. Well, okay, that makes sense. This is a time period where people are reporting increased mental health concerns across the board. Depression, anxiety, stress levels are way... including suicide attempts way up.

Mike: Who staffs the line?

Martina: Yeah, we really at Mental Health America across the nation, but here in Wisconsin we have a deep, deep, core value that people with lived experience are some of our best folks to provide interventions. So that warmline was designed and implemented and run by peers who have lived experience with mental illness and or substance use disorders.

Martina: So they ran the warmline and ran it well.

Mike: Wow.

Martina: So people with lived experience. Offering support and guidance to others, to their own peers?

Mike: Well, I have a few friends in the news media, and they would say, so far I've buried the lede. So let me get to the lede. What happened just a little while ago in March?

Martina: Mm-hmm. Yeah, sadly. We, as I mentioned this program was born out of the need a during and after the pandemic. And so we received ARPA dollars, American Rescue Plan dollars to get the program up and running for three years. And so sadly our current administration thought that because (finger quotes) COVID is over that those dollars weren't necessary any longer, not really thinking big picture that the fallout of COVID as you just listed, a litany of situations, depression, anxiety, increased suicides, increased suicide attempts. Having a warmline is still very, very much relevant.

Martina: And those dollars that supported it through September 30th were very much needed. But unfortunately, they were cut and our contract was cut and we had to end this service as of April 8th, 2025.

Mike: How much notice?

Martina: Oh gosh, Mike, (laughs) it almost makes me emotional to even talk about it. So we received a notice on March 27th from the Department of Health Services here in Wisconsin that our contract had actually ended on March 24th.

Martina: So we received the notification on the 27th that our contract had actually ended three days before.

Mike: There you go. Yeah.

Martina: Yeah.

Mike: That's like walking up the aisle and realizing the groom isn't there. Right.

Martina: I'll leave that alone. (laughs)

Mike: Yeah. It's just so... And you know, we both live in Wisconsin, for those of you listening elsewhere. And we have one of the only states, well, we have the only state where the reaction to the stress of COVID was all 72 counties in Wisconsin reported an uptick in excessive drinking. Which is, you know, leads to all sorts of different stuff. And the bleed over into mental health and mental illness is staggering.

Mike: And you also address those issues.

Martina: Well, first of all, alcohol is a depressant. So as you know, we, people don't think of it in that clinical term, but when people are struggling with their own wellness. Alcohol can easily turn into dependency, a crutch, self-medication to help cope with whatever the stressors might be.

Martina: So, yep, it makes sense that people were drinking more. Unfortunately, the safety nets that were normally in place, whether that be your colleagues at work or family members, people just weren't connected in the same way to be able to recognize the red flags. So a lot of those concerns went maybe unnoticed or unaddressed.

Mike: Well, and speaking of recognizing it, you said your hotline, your warmline, sorry, I'll get that wrong several times. Was staffed by peer specialists who had been through it, what happened to them?

Martina: Yes. So we really tried to, do a lot of outreach to the community. So we had some fundraisers, which were still running.

Martina: But I actually reached out to some of our local funders for emergency funding and United Way responded graciously. But, and so did a couple of others. Unfortunately, because there was so much uncertainty we were unable to extend the warmline beyond the eighth. And so I say that even though we had received some emergency funding, that funding really was to help cover the time from the 24th until the eighth when we weren't receiving funding, but still providing service to the community. We really were trying to raise funds to bridge the gap between now and the fall, September 30th.

Martina: One of the pieces that is missing maybe from this conversation is that earlier on, before we had received the notification of the termination of our contract, we had been told and had seen during the governor's budget briefing that 1.2 million has been earmarked for the warmline. And so the ARPA funding would've taken us through September 30th. And that would've been a really nice transition for us.

Martina: Or if someone else was running the warmline, the funding would've been there in the fall when the ARPA funding ran out. And then the governor's funding would've picked right up and there would've been a seamless continuation of services.

Mike: So in a perfect world, you would've bridged that gap.

Mike: And now if it does come through, you'll have to restart the whole.

Martina: Yeah. So again, we have a couple of grant applications pending which if we receive any kind of substantial funding, we would still need to operate the warmline in a limited capacity. Less hours, less staff until we were sure about the governor's budget being passed.

Martina: And this money still being available.

Mike: And how often was the line open?

Martina: Yeah, so. Right when I'm saying 24,000 people last year, people are probably going, wow. We were open seven days a week, 10 hours a day. The state had originally wanted us to be open 24/7. But I have an amazing team and they were really tracking when calls were coming and when the volume was the highest.

Martina: Apparently anytime after like midnight, people really were not utilizing the warmline. So it was a way for us to be able to save money so that we could continue the service at the highest quality possible and still be able to pay our, our operators as much as we possibly could and remain open when people really needed us.

Martina: It didn't make sense to have someone staffing the line at 3:00 AM when no one was calling it.

Mike: It's always nice when you actually have research available for the information. So before I ask you if you're optimistic or whatever, so the people who would be calling the line, now, what other options are available?

Mike: This creates a gap. So now where do they go?

Martina: Yeah. So because we didn't have a lot of time, obviously, and that's part of the reason, so when we received the information on March 27th. There was a lot of scrambling but mainly our warmline operators wanted to make sure that callers knew and that they had time to pivot.

Martina: So we stayed open till April 8th so that we could, so not only our callers, but also the staff. I wanted to give them a chance to make some arrangements for themselves, whether that's unemployment or another job. But all of our callers were informed that when the warmline was ending. And they were notified that Mental Health America is still a resource.

Martina: So we are not open till, you know 12 hours a day. But we do have someone during business hours who is able to, take live calls, provide referrals and resource information. And as well as we made sure that they knew what the text line, what the other crisis lines in the state, as well as some of the other lines prevention lines across the nation that are open 24/7.

Martina: We made sure. And so we also have a message when people call, in case they didn't. Call us during that week and a half when we were making sure to notify.

Mike: Well, the National Line 988, the Suicide National Hotline is also under the knife, so to speak.

Martina: And interestingly, 988 and the warmline really had different goals and purposes.

Martina: So we would typically not refer someone to 988 if, they were unable to call Uplift because if they're not in crisis, then they shouldn't be calling a crisis line. That's why we have warmlines. So there are, gosh, there's three respites in the state of Wisconsin which are places where people can go and have a free stay.

Martina: Up to seven days, at no cost to themselves, in an effort to avoid a crisis. And so they're called peer respites, again, run by peers who have lived experience. And so each of the respites, that are open 24/7, they also have peers on staff. Is it ideal? No.

Martina: But we made sure that people knew that that resource was available as well.

Mike: I think what a lot of people, Martina, since you've done this your life and I have too, what a lot of people miss, they see the money spent rather than the money saved. Programs like this save a lot, you know, the cost of going to an emergency room or involving law enforcement.

Mike: Every time there's a mental health call, I think the entire fire department shows up. That's just a little bit of hyperbole, but not much. So it saves money as well as saving lives.

Martina: And that has been my message, so is I am so appreciative of folks like yourself that have been reaching out, asking me to share this, our story that is the truth.

Martina: And so this program was devised, when DHS put out their request for proposal, it was with the intent to decrease folks from having to utilize the emergency room when it wasn't a crisis, but they had no idea where else to go. Or to be hospitalized, psychiatric hospitalizations or God forbid, contact with law enforcement.

Martina: Right. I think all of us would appreciate our law enforcement doing the job that they were intended to do, not being social workers and spending their whole shift and beyond over time in a hospital waiting room. Like that's just insane. So. The warmline, the respites, those were all created.

Martina: So when someone who knows themselves that they really need to take a break and get some support, they know where to go. We're there, whether they call us and talk to... Some of our calls lasted up to 45 minutes, sometimes an hour. That's real support in real time. And that's gone now.

Mike: Yeah. When you talk about the funding trimming, you know, and everybody always says, oh, I'm all for saving money. Okay, all right. But there needs to be some thought, just not this cross the slash and burn, you know, you don't burn the whole field down and you have data to support your stuff.

Mike: So it's the old, throw the baby out with the bath water thing. We don't even, it seems like they're not even aware of what's being cut.

Martina: As I mentioned, our understanding is that the word, you know, that this, this money was in response to the pandemic. And so our current administration really is just slashing.

Martina: And anything that does not align with the current values or ideals that's how they're making decisions. And so, as I said. People are still recovering and so having some place to call to decrease anxiety and depression symptoms so that they can still get up and go to work or still have healthy relationships, stay out of the hospital, not have contact with law enforcement.

Martina: Makes perfect preventative sense to me, but apparently everyone doesn't agree with that.

Mike: Yeah, I guess not. (laughs) Are you now I know you have, I know, I know you have to walk a line here because it's not until September you said, but are you hopeful that the state of Wisconsin can fill the funding gap?

Mike: And for those of you listening in other states, we, the reason I'm asking this is we have a, a Democratic governor, like some states and a heavily Republican legislature who don't always play nice in the sandbox.

Martina: They don't. But I think our governor's efforts to increase dollars for mental health and children's mental health and have it well received speaks to the overarching support for mental health and wellness in our state.

Martina: I cannot say what will happen in June when it's time to pass the budget. But I am very hopeful and truthfully the money that's earmarked is not guaranteed to Mental Health America Wisconsin, but it is guaranteed to the Uplift program. Right. So I, you know, I wanna make that distinction.

Martina: So we would have to re-apply, but it's about the program, the service. And we don't want that to go away for wisconsinites.

Mike: Do you know about hearings? Have you been asked to testify, have people reached out to you?

Martina: No, interestingly not. So there is a hearing from my understanding that was in the notice that I received, tomorrow, April 16th.

Martina: That will determine the outcome of the temporary restraining order that was issued on April 4th. I'm very interested, but no one has asked for me to testify. I would've happily had a few things to say.

Mike: Well I'm sure you're reaching out to those people who will be making those decisions just to let them know, you know one way or another, here's how many people have used it and here's what it saves.

Mike: Can you talk just for a minute, we'll get off of this for a second. What other services does Mental Health America Wisconsin provide?

Martina: Yeah, thank you for asking that. Which has been part of my messaging, right? So Uplift is going away, but we want people to know that MHA Wisconsin is still a resource.

Martina: So one of our largest initiatives that most people are aware of is our suicide prevention. We are, I like to say we're small but mighty, but we are the leading voice in suicide prevention. And so we have a contract with DHS that helps us to provide oversight and technical assistance and training.

Martina: So we support more than 50 of the 72 counties in implementing suicide prevention initiatives. And then hence there's training and technical support to ensure that people in communities are getting the support that they need. So suicide prevention. We also, we have a annual suicide prevention conference.

Martina: Again, bringing communities together. We also provide outpatient clinical services. So our outpatient clinic is located in Milwaukee, but we're able to serve the entire state of Wisconsin via telehealth if needed. Just understanding that some rural communities have very limited access.

Martina: And so we also are providing school-based mental health in five of Milwaukee public schools. And we have a peer run veteran respite where this is a, I mentioned a respite earlier, but not ours specifically. So respites are for folks. Again, wanting to avoid utilization of crisis services and to avoid a crisis in their own life.

Martina: But more importantly the respite is run by veterans who they themselves identify as peers with lived experience with mental illness and or substance use disorder. So we have a lovely facility in, it's a house, I shouldn't say facility, in Pewaukee where veterans can literally take respite.

Martina: It's called R&R House. So any vets would get that reference.

Mike: Well, that's where I'm sitting right now, so yeah. Not in the facility, but...

Martina: No, no, not in the house [inaudible]

Mike: That's my hometown. So how interesting. And I didn't know. So there you go.

Martina: Yeah. Yeah. We'll have to arrange a tour for you.

Mike: Yeah, that would be great.

Mike: And lastly, people I would imagine can donate or help or support whether it's a phone call to their legislator or in some way, what would be helpful for people who, 'cause we have a lot of, Martina, we have a lot of therapists who listen to this. A lot of people who have been through stuff and like to reach out and help when they can.

Martina: Yeah. And I appreciate you asking that. So yes, first of all, our website MHA Wisconsin all spelled out .org is a great place to donate. We are still running campaigns for the warmline. Save the Warmline. We actually have a fundraiser happening on May 10th in the Fox Cities. It's called Mocktail Bash.

Martina: Again, that is solely focused on supporting the warmline. Also please contact your legislators. I think we don't emphasize how impactful that can be when they hear from their constituents about a service that is going away or that has an impact whether personally for yourself, a loved one, or just your community?

Martina: So I encourage people to definitely reach out. We have been really trying to spread the word in that capacity. You know, Senator Baldwin is a staunch advocate and supporter for mental health. So yep, it still doesn't hurt to reach out to her office. But Ron Johnson's office as well.

Martina: Gwen Moore is also an amazing supporter. And then, you know, I just encourage you to, when you're sharing messaging, to remind people that these cuts are impacting real people.

Mike: Yes.

Martina: Who have real lives and real needs. And so I think that sometimes gets forgotten when we're talking about you know federal campaigns and federal cuts and a lot of bureaucratic verbiage.

Martina: I think people get lost and that we forget that this is happening to real people in real time and that they need these services so that they can maintain their independence in their own communities. So I hope that people really will reach out to whomever and just share that this is something that they think is of value.

Mike: Save's money, saves lives, saves time, saves souls.

Martina: I like that.

Mike: Yeah. Martina thanks so much for I, this has to be a difficult time. It's always difficult when you have no lead up to making decisions that are this big. As you know, Martina listed it. But attached to podcasts, there are links to Mental Health America Wisconsin attached to the podcast blurb.

Mike: Thanks for being with us today, and thanks for your work and your dedication. It's greatly appreciated. For all of you listening, listen, anytime you're able. Until then, stay safe, stay informed, and please let your voice be heard.